Dark Lord
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Contracts...was gonna send a PM......but maybe here would be a better place?
Anyway, after doing some work for Impact and then thinking about the PM I sent to Galak about Grandma Wendy and their outlook on PBeM I started thinking about Impact and it's relationship with me and my work.
I have never signed anything stating that any artwork I have done for you is not to be resold to anyone else. I never signed anything stating that the art became your property and, in fact, I have retained the originals.
Now, Lawquoter would probably be the one to know better but isn't this a chance for problems? I would never resell any sketches or other art I do for you, and it's more complicated when you talk about digital work like the board (which is copyright by you), but most people are dicks and many would. As far as I am concerned, if Impact asked for my hard copies I would turn them over no problem...but that may not be the case with all artists...and some may even try to recycle them.
A recycled sketch could result in a product by a different company looking too similar to an Impact mini. Whether that company's product was a mini, or a comic book, or whatever it could cause a legal issue. And as we all know, legal battles are often won by the rich, not the righteous.
I just wondered if you guys have discussed this with lawyer because I would hate to see Impact have legal problems because of some jaggov trying to make an easy buck.
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GalakStarscraper
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Re: Contracts...was gonna send a PM... | Dark Lord wrote: | | I just wondered if you guys have discussed this with lawyer because I would hate to see Impact have legal problems because of some jaggov trying to make an easy buck. |
All of our Targeted sculptors have to sign a contract giving us rights before we cast the figures.
As for imagery ... we normally work out very specific terms before agreeing to purchase the art.
As for your design for the board .. that was probably the most informal things I've done contract wise for over a year.
Galak
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Dark Lord
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Well what about the sketch I did for the Mid Kingdoms? I still own it, at least I possess it. I would never resell it but I was saying that I have signed no paper forbidding me from doing so.
In an example let's say I did sell it as a concept sketch for a character in an animated film about a fantasy football type game. Suddenly an animation studio (with presumably more money than Impact) has a character similar to an Impact miniature. Or worse, what if I had sold it to you second?
I never would, but I just thought I would bring it up.
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GalakStarscraper
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| Dark Lord wrote: | | Well what about the sketch I did for the Mid Kingdoms? |
We paid you for that artwork. Barring you having a contract that says otherwise standard contract law says the image becomes ours unless you state otherwise.
That's my understanding. A unique artwork created and then paid for as part of a design process becomes the property of the payer barring contractal agreement otherwise. The payment in lieu of other document becomes the legal contract.
Galak
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Dark Lord
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I understand that, but usually that happens with the originals changing hands. For example, if I did a page for a comic book I would physically send them the bristol board with the pencils on there. They bought the artwork and it was physically given to them.
The way we did it seems more ambiguous. You received a print of my original artwork. Now I understand that there was communication between us where it is more than implied that you were buying a likeness that I created, but that communication is informal.
I'm also saying that being right isn't always enough. If I were to say I interpreted it as you were buying a print of my work and not the original, what would stop me from selling that print to someone else?
And then, right or not, you have problems that have to be dealt with.
Anyway, I'll leave you alone about it. Don't want to give anyone any ideas lol. Just trying to think like jerk so in case you meet one. 
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GalakStarscraper
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| Dark Lord wrote: | | The way we did it seems more ambiguous. You received a print of my original artwork. Now I understand that there was communication between us where it is more than implied that you were buying a likeness that I created, but that communication is informal. |
I think I'd need to trust that the law would be on my side on this but will be more explicit in the future with my emails.
For example. I know Illustranger does most of his work digitally ... how am I supposed to receive the hard copy there? (ask for his computer???)
So I think the law would evolve with the technology on this one.
But you make a good point and I'll be more detailed in my emails in the future.
I have given the right back though to create prints of our figure sketches to Illustranger and Heather Bruton, so part of this is that I don't see a need to have 100% ownership of the image. I'd rather get the work cheaper with the understanding that the image is mine to produce as a sculpture and if the artist can make more money off it as a image later ... I'm okay with that.
Galak
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Dark Lord
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Like I said, just thinking protectively about you.
I wouldn't assume the law is evolved for digital and virtual stuff yet.
Not to be condescending but you are aware of the current problems in the music industry and the writers strike, are you not? 
American law...nay American Government is woefully out of date.
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GalakStarscraper
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| Dark Lord wrote: | Like I said, just thinking protectively about you.
I wouldn't assume the law is evolved for digital and virtual stuff yet.
Not to be condescending but you are aware of the current problems in the music industry and the writers strike, are you not?
American law...nay American Government is woefully out of date. |
Yeah I stay pretty up to date on the Entertainment industry both gaming and other through RSS feeds (people.com and TGN.com) and publications I subscribe to (Entertainment Weekly and Wired).
So that's why I said ... that I'd be more detailed in the future .. because I do agree you have a point. So I'm agreeing with you big man that I need to beef up the contract stuff in relation to the art ... easy on me.
Galak
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Dark Lord
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Rabid.
I can't help it.
My wife calls me the relentless questioner because I ask a few questions and even when she has told me she has no answer I continue to ask (what I feel are rhetorical) questions until she breaks.
I was told at a very young age that there were no stupid questions and that I should never be afraid to ask questions. That teacher ate those words. 
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Ramrider
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There are no stupid questions... only stupid people.
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Lychanthrope
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"Stupid" people ask stupid questions like:
When is this due? Right after I told you.
How do I do this? Right after I spent 5 minutes telling you.
What's this for? Right after I finished telling you.
Are we getting a grade for this? (you guessed it) Right after I just answered that question.
Sorry, spent too many years as a teacher, and my wife is a teacher, not to admit that there are stupid questions. 
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Dark Lord
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Don't forget:
"Is this gonna be on the final exam?"
It is now, idiot.
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Ramrider
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Or: "How much is this?" (In a pound shop)
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brownrob
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Best one I got when I worked in the bank
"Is the bank open on Bank Holiday Monday?"
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GalakStarscraper
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| brownrob wrote: | Best one I got when I worked in the bank
"Is the bank open on Bank Holiday Monday?"
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My best one I got was when I worked for a Grocery store.
I worked produce (fruits and veggies). I'd been packaging fresh strawberries for sale all morning and the big green apron I wear for my job was covered in strawberry juice along with my hands being tinted red.
So next mission was to refill the lettuce. So I grab a 40 lb. box of lettuce (which is a big box), and am out in the grocery aisle.
Now picture this. Strawberry stained hands, massively red stained bright green apron, big box of lettuce balanced on one knee while my other hand is holding a pricing gun to put prices on the lettuce heads.
Lady walks up to me and asks .... you guessed it:
"Do you work here?"
 
Galak
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Dark Lord
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| GalakStarscraper wrote: | "Do you work here?"
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"No. I'm just a serial killer who loves lettuce!!"
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Darkson
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A few Sundays ago, I was let down (again ) by my 8am shifter, so I was on my own in the store until 10am. So I'm behind the till. I'm clearing the small queue of customers, and the old woman that is next in line says, "Do you work here?".
No, we just let any old person behind the till, you stupid bat!
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brownrob
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Thing that really annoys me the most is...
Answering the telephone...
Me: Good morning, <insert company name>, how may I help you?
Customer: Hello. Is that <insert company name> ?
   
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Darkson
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I had one recently.
"Hello, [company here] Kingsway Gardens, how can I help."
[Manc accent] "Oh, hello, I'm looking for the number for [some store] in Manchester."
"Um, I think you've got the wrong number, we're in Hampshire, south of England."
"Oh, I thought you'd know all the numbers."
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GalakStarscraper
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| Dark Lord wrote: | | GalakStarscraper wrote: | "Do you work here?"
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"No. I'm just a serial killer who loves lettuce!!" |
If we find a way to send messages back in time ... I'm SO telling myself this one ...
Galak
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Illustranger
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wich I could participate in the offtopicness.
but Im afraid Ive asked the most silly questions I know personally myself ;)
(I usually speak first, think never.)
ontopic ; nowadays I usually state up front that the copyright is shared copyright somehow, the commissioner can do whatever they want to promotionally etc. etc. but I can also use it promotionally, sell as print, have printed in magazines if it is to promote me as an artist etc. etc. wherever possible with mention of the other *copyright* holder, so, for example I mention impact (or in my case, I just slap on the (c)@ impact miniatures) when its published somewhere else, however it can never be resold to other licenses, copyrights etc. etc. without both agreeing to it
however, as Im working with impact since a very long time I dont remember if I stated the shared copyright thing, or we had another agreement, but usually it comes down to the same thing anyway :)
the above also depends on subject, logos are always copyright of the contracter, even if no contract is signed, otherwise it can get ugly later on.
make no mistake tough, in many cases written stuff counts legally, its not a contract, but it can work for/against you in legal issues, I think..
(I put it down more confident than I feel it :))
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